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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 11-05-2003, 06:13 PM
Konrad Eisele
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Default Announcement

I will write a open source arm vhdl model from
this month on. I hope to have it ready in
approximately 2 months using LeonSoc as a framework
and implementing a arm1 integerunit. Anyone that wants
to participate is wellcome.
Konrad Eisele
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 11-05-2003, 06:28 PM
Andras Tantos
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Default Re: Announcement

> I will write a open source arm vhdl model from
> this month on. I hope to have it ready in
> approximately 2 months using LeonSoc as a framework
> and implementing a arm1 integerunit. Anyone that wants
> to participate is wellcome.
> Konrad Eisele


Many tried, all got kicked in the back by ARM. If you can create something
useful, get ready for a contact from one of their lawyers,

Andras Tantos


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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 11-06-2003, 09:29 AM
Antti Lukats
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Default Re: Announcement

"Andras Tantos" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> > I will write a open source arm vhdl model from
> > this month on. I hope to have it ready in
> > approximately 2 months using LeonSoc as a framework
> > and implementing a arm1 integerunit. Anyone that wants
> > to participate is wellcome.
> > Konrad Eisele

>
> Many tried, all got kicked in the back by ARM. If you can create something
> useful, get ready for a contact from one of their lawyers,
>
> Andras Tantos


why write it from scratch? the nnARM source codes can be found with google
with no problems. the synthesis result is unfortunatly quite big fits
barely into XC2S600E

would be nice to have smaller core though

antti
PS the ARMlayers tried to take nnARM off from public internet, but its
still downloadable, so the layers are not doing very good job.
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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 11-07-2003, 01:09 AM
john jakson
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Default Re: Announcement

[email protected] (Antti Lukats) wrote in message news:<[email protected] com>...
> "Andras Tantos" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> > > I will write a open source arm vhdl model from
> > > this month on. I hope to have it ready in
> > > approximately 2 months using LeonSoc as a framework
> > > and implementing a arm1 integerunit. Anyone that wants
> > > to participate is wellcome.
> > > Konrad Eisele

> >
> > Many tried, all got kicked in the back by ARM. If you can create something
> > useful, get ready for a contact from one of their lawyers,
> >
> > Andras Tantos

>
> why write it from scratch? the nnARM source codes can be found with google
> with no problems. the synthesis result is unfortunatly quite big fits
> barely into XC2S600E
>
> would be nice to have smaller core though
>
> antti
> PS the ARMlayers tried to take nnARM off from public internet, but its
> still downloadable, so the layers are not doing very good job.


Doesn't really matter, good enough in this case, lets any potential
commercial user get the message loud & clear. If its a 600 target,
thats one very expensive Arm compared to real thing. For an opensource
cpu to be useable, it must be competitive in size, speed, power with
commercial cpus.

johnjaksonATusaDOTcom
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 11-07-2003, 09:48 AM
Jon Beniston
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Default Re: Announcement

"Andras Tantos" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> > I will write a open source arm vhdl model from
> > this month on. I hope to have it ready in
> > approximately 2 months using LeonSoc as a framework
> > and implementing a arm1 integerunit. Anyone that wants
> > to participate is wellcome.
> > Konrad Eisele

>
> Many tried, all got kicked in the back by ARM. If you can create something
> useful, get ready for a contact from one of their lawyers,


I wrote my own clone earlier this year (just haven't got around to
releasing it yet). I spent quite a bit of time studying the patent
issues, and believe that
you should be able to implement the basic V4 instruction set (This
doens't include Thumb). The only real hurdle is then likey to be
patent 5,386,563 which deals with the exception processing mechanism.
However, I believe this patent to be invalid, as there is a
significant amount of prior art (Search for "ARM's dubious patents" in
comp.arch).

Cheers,
JonB
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 11-07-2003, 09:51 AM
Jon Beniston
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: Announcement

[email protected] (Antti Lukats) wrote in message news:<[email protected] com>...
> "Andras Tantos" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> > > I will write a open source arm vhdl model from
> > > this month on. I hope to have it ready in
> > > approximately 2 months using LeonSoc as a framework
> > > and implementing a arm1 integerunit. Anyone that wants
> > > to participate is wellcome.
> > > Konrad Eisele

> >
> > Many tried, all got kicked in the back by ARM. If you can create something
> > useful, get ready for a contact from one of their lawyers,
> >
> > Andras Tantos

>
> why write it from scratch? the nnARM source codes can be found with google
> with no problems. the synthesis result is unfortunatly quite big fits
> barely into XC2S600E
>
> would be nice to have smaller core though
>
> antti
> PS the ARMlayers tried to take nnARM off from public internet, but its
> still downloadable, so the layers are not doing very good job.


I'm not sure if it has been worked on since the last time I saw it,
but I don't believe the nnARM could really be used as is. Didn't it
just come with a behavioural memory interface? I also seem to remember
the pipeline being pretty shallow, meaning it isn't exactly going to
go very fast.

Cheers,
Jon
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  #7 (permalink)  
Old 11-07-2003, 09:59 AM
Jon Beniston
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: Announcement

> > > > I will write a open source arm vhdl model from
> > > > this month on. I hope to have it ready in
> > > > approximately 2 months using LeonSoc as a framework
> > > > and implementing a arm1 integerunit. Anyone that wants
> > > > to participate is wellcome.
> > > > Konrad Eisele
> > >
> > > Many tried, all got kicked in the back by ARM. If you can create something
> > > useful, get ready for a contact from one of their lawyers,
> > >
> > > Andras Tantos

> >
> > why write it from scratch? the nnARM source codes can be found with google
> > with no problems. the synthesis result is unfortunatly quite big fits
> > barely into XC2S600E
> >
> > would be nice to have smaller core though
> >
> > antti
> > PS the ARMlayers tried to take nnARM off from public internet, but its
> > still downloadable, so the layers are not doing very good job.

>
> Doesn't really matter, good enough in this case, lets any potential
> commercial user get the message loud & clear. If its a 600 target,
> thats one very expensive Arm compared to real thing. For an opensource
> cpu to be useable, it must be competitive in size, speed, power with
> commercial cpus.


And if you want to be better than the competition, don't base your
design on ARM. It has (IMHO) a huge flaw in the architecture
(shifting), that means if you want decent performance, you end up
having to add tons of extra logic.

Jon
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  #8 (permalink)  
Old 11-07-2003, 12:14 PM
Konrad Eisele
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: Announcement

[email protected] (john jakson) wrote in message news:<[email protected] com>...
> [email protected] (Antti Lukats) wrote in message news:<[email protected] com>...
> > "Andras Tantos" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> > > > I will write a open source arm vhdl model from
> > > > this month on. I hope to have it ready in
> > > > approximately 2 months using LeonSoc as a framework
> > > > and implementing a arm1 integerunit. Anyone that wants
> > > > to participate is wellcome.
> > > > Konrad Eisele
> > >
> > > Many tried, all got kicked in the back by ARM. If you can create something
> > > useful, get ready for a contact from one of their lawyers,
> > >
> > > Andras Tantos

> >
> > why write it from scratch? the nnARM source codes can be found with google
> > with no problems. the synthesis result is unfortunatly quite big fits
> > barely into XC2S600E
> >
> > would be nice to have smaller core though
> >
> > antti
> > PS the ARMlayers tried to take nnARM off from public internet, but its
> > still downloadable, so the layers are not doing very good job.

>
> Doesn't really matter, good enough in this case, lets any potential
> commercial user get the message loud & clear. If its a 600 target,
> thats one very expensive Arm compared to real thing. For an opensource
> cpu to be useable, it must be competitive in size, speed, power with
> commercial cpus.
>
> johnjaksonATusaDOTcom


Does anyone know when the arm license is going to expire?
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  #9 (permalink)  
Old 11-07-2003, 08:15 PM
Jon Beniston
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: Announcement

> > Doesn't really matter, good enough in this case, lets any potential
> > commercial user get the message loud & clear. If its a 600 target,
> > thats one very expensive Arm compared to real thing. For an opensource
> > cpu to be useable, it must be competitive in size, speed, power with
> > commercial cpus.
> >
> > johnjaksonATusaDOTcom

>
> Does anyone know when the arm license is going to expire?


I think the exception processing patent was filed around 90-92, so its
got quite a bit in it left..

JonB
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  #10 (permalink)  
Old 11-11-2003, 01:25 AM
Eric Smith
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: Announcement

[email protected] (Jon Beniston) writes:
> I wrote my own clone earlier this year (just haven't got around to
> releasing it yet). I spent quite a bit of time studying the patent
> issues, and believe that
> you should be able to implement the basic V4 instruction set (This
> doens't include Thumb). The only real hurdle is then likey to be
> patent 5,386,563 which deals with the exception processing mechanism.
> However, I believe this patent to be invalid, as there is a
> significant amount of prior art (Search for "ARM's dubious patents" in
> comp.arch).


If you only need binary compatibility with user-mode ARM software, you
can implement a different exception handling mechanism and avoid the
patented technique entirely.
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