FPGA Central

Need to make a selection of which scope to buy for DDR2/3 i/f JEDEC compliance testing on the memory controller(s). I personally like Tek scope but it is more expensive and its DDR compliance test software doesn't support all the required parameters.
Did anybody evaluate both scopes for this application and which one you picked? What were pros/cons to go with Tek vs Agilent or vice versa?

Thanks in advance

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Eugene
From the probing easiness for DDR, agilent makes life easier but the tek has
come out with a DDR analysis s/w and trimode probes which are worth trying.
Check it out..
Regards
YPK
On Fri, Apr 17, 2009 at 9:37 AM, Eugene Ivanov <eugene.ivanov (AT) nxp (DOT) com>wrote:

> Need to make a selection of which scope to buy for DDR2/3 i/f JEDEC
> compliance testing on the memory controller(s). I personally like Tek scope
> but it is more expensive and its DDR compliance test software doesn't
> support all the required parameters.
> Did anybody evaluate both scopes for this application and which one you
> picked? What were pros/cons to go with Tek vs Agilent or vice versa?
>
> Thanks in advance
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe from si-list:
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Eugene,

I wanted to let you know that there will soon be a 3rd option for
validating signals on a DDR2 interface. LeCroy will be introducing a DDR2
compliance testing package next month that you might want to check out.
It will support measurement of the full parameter set. Our solution uses
long waveform captures to speed up the time to gather large numbers of
samples of each parameter.

Best Regards,
Jim




James J Mueller
LeCroy Corporation




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| From: |
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|Eugene Ivanov <eugene.ivanov (AT) nxp (DOT) com> |
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
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| To: |
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|"si-list (AT) freelists (DOT) org" <si-list (AT) freelists (DOT) org> |
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| Date: |
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|04/17/2009 12:08 AM |
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| Subject: |
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|[SI-LIST] Pros/Cons of Agilent vs Tek scope for DDR2/DDR3 characterization |
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
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| Sent by: |
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|si-list-bounce (AT) freelists (DOT) org |
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|





Need to make a selection of which scope to buy for DDR2/3 i/f JEDEC
compliance testing on the memory controller(s). I personally like Tek scope
but it is more expensive and its DDR compliance test software doesn't
support all the required parameters.
Did anybody evaluate both scopes for this application and which one you
picked? What were pros/cons to go with Tek vs Agilent or vice versa?

Thanks in advance

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Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at:
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My problem with Agilent scope is that it doesn't support a crossover measurement of the dif signal as a standalone application, only as a part of the compliance test. Another usefull feature Agilent missing is gating the measurements by cursors. For instance, I'm looking at DQS Read immediately followed by DQS Write and want to make a crossover measurements only on DQS Write (or just first DQS Write transition) - the situation where On-die termination turns-off on the controller and turns-on on the memory. I've been told the work-around on Agilent is to zoom into the area of concern. But it won't work with Infiniscan triggers

From: praveen kumar [mailto:ypk705 (AT) gmail (DOT) com]
Sent: Thursday, April 16, 2009 11:39 PM
To: Eugene Ivanov
Cc: si-list (AT) freelists (DOT) org
Subject: Re: [SI-LIST] Pros/Cons of Agilent vs Tek scope for DDR2/DDR3 characterization

Eugene
From the probing easiness for DDR, agilent makes life easier but the tek has come out with a DDR analysis s/w and trimode probes which are worth trying. Check it out..
Regards
YPK
On Fri, Apr 17, 2009 at 9:37 AM, Eugene Ivanov <eugene.ivanov (AT) nxp (DOT) com<mailto:eugene.ivanov (AT) nxp (DOT) com>> wrote:
Need to make a selection of which scope to buy for DDR2/3 i/f JEDEC compliance testing on the memory controller(s). I personally like Tek scope but it is more expensive and its DDR compliance test software doesn't support all the required parameters.
Did anybody evaluate both scopes for this application and which one you picked? What were pros/cons to go with Tek vs Agilent or vice versa?

Thanks in advance

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Hi....
good to hear this.... but personally, i have used Tek, Agilent, Lecroy
scopes....

one thing i observed is Agilent is far superior in noise floor spec, and in
usage model, Lecroy, try autoscaling the signal... what will happen is it
takes long time to pop the signal up in window, and at the bottom it says, "
Calibrating"... some times it takes very long time compared to Tek and
Agilent. i m not sure what kind of trigger they use to separate the Read and
Write cycle in DDR for validation.

If anyone has some information please pass in......


Thanks,
prasad




2009/4/17 Eugene Ivanov <eugene.ivanov (AT) nxp (DOT) com>

> My problem with Agilent scope is that it doesn't support a crossover
> measurement of the dif signal as a standalone application, only as a part of
> the compliance test. Another usefull feature Agilent missing is gating the
> measurements by cursors. For instance, I'm looking at DQS Read immediately
> followed by DQS Write and want to make a crossover measurements only on DQS
> Write (or just first DQS Write transition) - the situation where On-die
> termination turns-off on the controller and turns-on on the memory. I've
> been told the work-around on Agilent is to zoom into the area of concern.
> But it won't work with Infiniscan triggers
>
> From: praveen kumar [mailto:ypk705 (AT) gmail (DOT) com]
> Sent: Thursday, April 16, 2009 11:39 PM
> To: Eugene Ivanov
> Cc: si-list (AT) freelists (DOT) org
> Subject: Re: [SI-LIST] Pros/Cons of Agilent vs Tek scope for DDR2/DDR3
> characterization
>
> Eugene
> From the probing easiness for DDR, agilent makes life easier but the tek
> has come out with a DDR analysis s/w and trimode probes which are worth
> trying. Check it out..
> Regards
> YPK
> On Fri, Apr 17, 2009 at 9:37 AM, Eugene Ivanov <eugene.ivanov (AT) nxp (DOT) com
> <mailto:eugene.ivanov (AT) nxp (DOT) com>> wrote:
> Need to make a selection of which scope to buy for DDR2/3 i/f JEDEC
> compliance testing on the memory controller(s). I personally like Tek scope
> but it is more expensive and its DDR compliance test software doesn't
> support all the required parameters.
> Did anybody evaluate both scopes for this application and which one you
> picked? What were pros/cons to go with Tek vs Agilent or vice versa?
>
> Thanks in advance
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe from si-list:
> si-list-request (AT) freelists (DOT)...ists (DOT) org> with
> 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field
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>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
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> Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at:
> http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu
>
>
>


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Hi Prasad,

I am pleased to be able to tell you that LeCroy has drastically improved
the calibration delays in our mid and high end line of real-time scopes
introduced over the last year. I can't say the same about our Autoscale -
it still takes longer than we would like. We have started to overhaul the
Autoscale feature and expect to have an order of magnitude decrease
in the time it takes when it is released in the latter half of this
calendar
year.

For DDR, we acquire long records with many read and write bursts using
a simple hardware trigger, and quickly scan through the data record in
software identifying the read and write bursts. By doing the
identification
in software, we believe it can be more robust particularly when the
signal quality is poor.

Regards,
Jim



James J Mueller
Engineering manager
Serial Data Solutions Group
LeCroy Corporation




|------------>
| From: |
|------------>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|prasad <hariprasad.palli (AT) gmail (DOT) com> |
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|------------>
| To: |
|------------>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|Eugene Ivanov <eugene.ivanov (AT) nxp (DOT) com> |
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|------------>
| Cc: |
|------------>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|praveen kumar <ypk705 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>, "si-list (AT) freelists (DOT) org" <si-list (AT) freelists (DOT) org> |
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|------------>
| Date: |
|------------>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|04/17/2009 01:22 PM |
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|------------>
| Subject: |
|------------>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|[SI-LIST] Re: Pros/Cons of Agilent vs Tek scope for DDR2/DDR3 characterization |
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|------------>
| Sent by: |
|------------>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|si-list-bounce (AT) freelists (DOT) org |
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|





Hi....
good to hear this.... but personally, i have used Tek, Agilent, Lecroy
scopes....

one thing i observed is Agilent is far superior in noise floor spec, and in
usage model, Lecroy, try autoscaling the signal... what will happen is it
takes long time to pop the signal up in window, and at the bottom it says,
"
Calibrating"... some times it takes very long time compared to Tek and
Agilent. i m not sure what kind of trigger they use to separate the Read
and
Write cycle in DDR for validation.

If anyone has some information please pass in......


Thanks,
prasad




2009/4/17 Eugene Ivanov <eugene.ivanov (AT) nxp (DOT) com>

> My problem with Agilent scope is that it doesn't support a crossover
> measurement of the dif signal as a standalone application, only as a part
of
> the compliance test. Another usefull feature Agilent missing is gating
the
> measurements by cursors. For instance, I'm looking at DQS Read
immediately
> followed by DQS Write and want to make a crossover measurements only on
DQS
> Write (or just first DQS Write transition) - the situation where On-die
> termination turns-off on the controller and turns-on on the memory. I've
> been told the work-around on Agilent is to zoom into the area of concern.
> But it won't work with Infiniscan triggers
>
> From: praveen kumar [mailto:ypk705 (AT) gmail (DOT) com]
> Sent: Thursday, April 16, 2009 11:39 PM
> To: Eugene Ivanov
> Cc: si-list (AT) freelists (DOT) org
> Subject: Re: [SI-LIST] Pros/Cons of Agilent vs Tek scope for DDR2/DDR3
> characterization
>
> Eugene
> From the probing easiness for DDR, agilent makes life easier but the tek
> has come out with a DDR analysis s/w and trimode probes which are worth
> trying. Check it out..
> Regards
> YPK
> On Fri, Apr 17, 2009 at 9:37 AM, Eugene Ivanov <eugene.ivanov (AT) nxp (DOT) com
> <mailto:eugene.ivanov (AT) nxp (DOT) com>> wrote:
> Need to make a selection of which scope to buy for DDR2/3 i/f JEDEC
> compliance testing on the memory controller(s). I personally like Tek
scope
> but it is more expensive and its DDR compliance test software doesn't
> support all the required parameters.
> Did anybody evaluate both scopes for this application and which one you
> picked? What were pros/cons to go with Tek vs Agilent or vice versa?
>
> Thanks in advance
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe from si-list:
> si-list-request (AT) freelists (DOT)...ists (DOT) org> with
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>
> List archives are viewable at:
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> Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at:
> http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu
>
>
>
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I would have thought that the first decision cut would
be the probes?
Who has the better probe set?


-----Original Message-----
From: si-list-bounce (AT) freelists (DOT) org [mailto:si-list-bounce (AT) freelists (DOT) org]
On Behalf Of Eugene Ivanov
Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 7:27 AM
To: praveen kumar
Cc: si-list (AT) freelists (DOT) org
Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: Pros/Cons of Agilent vs Tek scope for DDR2/DDR3
characterization

My problem with Agilent scope is that it doesn't support a crossover
measurement of the dif signal as a standalone application, only as a
part of the compliance test. Another usefull feature Agilent missing is
gating the measurements by cursors. For instance, I'm looking at DQS
Read immediately followed by DQS Write and want to make a crossover
measurements only on DQS Write (or just first DQS Write transition) -
the situation where On-die termination turns-off on the controller and
turns-on on the memory. I've been told the work-around on Agilent is to
zoom into the area of concern. But it won't work with Infiniscan
triggers

From: praveen kumar [mailto:ypk705 (AT) gmail (DOT) com]
Sent: Thursday, April 16, 2009 11:39 PM
To: Eugene Ivanov
Cc: si-list (AT) freelists (DOT) org
Subject: Re: [SI-LIST] Pros/Cons of Agilent vs Tek scope for DDR2/DDR3
characterization

Eugene
From the probing easiness for DDR, agilent makes life easier but the tek
has come out with a DDR analysis s/w and trimode probes which are worth
trying. Check it out..
Regards
YPK
On Fri, Apr 17, 2009 at 9:37 AM, Eugene Ivanov
<eugene.ivanov (AT) nxp (DOT) com<mailto:eugene.ivanov (AT) nxp (DOT) com>> wrote:
Need to make a selection of which scope to buy for DDR2/3 i/f JEDEC
compliance testing on the memory controller(s). I personally like Tek
scope but it is more expensive and its DDR compliance test software
doesn't support all the required parameters.
Did anybody evaluate both scopes for this application and which one you
picked? What were pros/cons to go with Tek vs Agilent or vice versa?

Thanks in advance

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