FPGA Central

Hi

Im about to start my final year at university and undertake my specilised
DSP module. Can anybody advice me on some warm up maths to prepare me? I
would preper if somebody could recommend a book with plenty of undergraduate
worked examples.

Cheers Turbo

1 - 1 = 0

2 + 2 =4

3 * 5 = 15


Sorry I couldn't resist.....

Just look through any "Signals and Systems" books and freshen up on
Fourier Series, Laplace transforms, Z-transforms.

DSP is a broad term, are you doing image processing, filtering, ...
each niche requires a different set of math skills. Some are heavier in
Algebra, some in infinite series, some differential equations, etc.

Tuurbo46 wrote:
> Im about to start my final year at university and undertake my specilised
> DSP module. Can anybody advice me on some warm up maths to prepare me?

Some of the math textbooks which I had to dig out of storage to refresh
my memory before starting on some DSP related projects included those
covering calculus of complex variables and numerical analysis (paying
attention to algorithmic stability and error bounds). Good working
knowledge of good ole' binary arithmetic was also helpful for many
types of DSP projects.

But as another poster mentioned, DSP covers a lot of engineering
problem areas, each possibly requiring its own area of mathmatics
for a better understanding (including, but not limited to:
linear algebra, orthogonal function representations, information
theory, statistical analysis, etc., etc.)


IMHO. YMMV.
--
rhn A.T nicholson d.O.t C-o-M

"Tuurbo46" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:dd0c5q$5t7$[email protected]..
> Hi
>
> Im about to start my final year at university and undertake my specilised
> DSP module. Can anybody advice me on some warm up maths to prepare me? I
> would preper if somebody could recommend a book with plenty of
undergraduate
> worked examples.
>
> Cheers Turbo
>
>
Well the first thing is to spell it right...Maths (plural) as in proper
English.

Shytot

in article oDXIe.684$[email protected], Shytot at [email protected]
wrote on 08/06/2005 01:10:

> "Tuurbo46" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:dd0c5q$5t7$[email protected]..
>>
>> Im about to start my final year at university and undertake my specilised
>> DSP module. Can anybody advice me on some warm up maths to prepare me? I
>> would preper if somebody could recommend a book with plenty of
>> undergraduate worked examples.
>>
....
> Well the first thing is to spell it right...Maths (plural) as in proper
> English.

might be proper English but improper American (dunno what them Canuks have
to say about it - they say "Zed"). on this side of the pond, we say "math"
for the same reason we say "history" (instead of "Don't know much about
histories, don't know much about biologies...").

but since Tuurbo is posting from svr.pol.co.uk, you might have a point.

BTW, Tuurbo, you might need to hire a tutor. when i was at Northwestern,
the Tech Institute had dozens of posters up by tutors advertising. i think
some of them were grad students or post-grads or maybe some very bright
seniors.

--

r b-j [email protected]

"Imagination is more important than knowledge."

Shytot wrote:
> "Tuurbo46" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:dd0c5q$5t7$[email protected]..
> > Hi
> >
> > Im about to start my final year at university and undertake my specilised
> > DSP module. Can anybody advice me on some warm up maths to prepare me? I
> > would preper if somebody could recommend a book with plenty of
> undergraduate
> > worked examples.
> >
> > Cheers Turbo
> >
> >
> Well the first thing is to spell it right...Maths (plural) as in proper
> English.
>
> Shytot

Richard Feynman calls it math. Looks like the noble prize winner is
wrong. Maybe you are super women. I will try to look out for your
name on the next Physics paper.

Shytot wrote:
> "Tuurbo46" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:dd0c5q$5t7$[email protected]..
>
>>Hi
>>
>>Im about to start my final year at university and undertake my specilised
>>DSP module. Can anybody advice me on some warm up maths to prepare me? I
>>would preper if somebody could recommend a book with plenty of
>
> undergraduate
>
>>worked examples.
>>
>>Cheers Turbo
>>
>>
>
> Well the first thing is to spell it right...Maths (plural) as in proper
> English.
>
> Shytot

And I suppose you want me to spell aluminum "alumulum" or some such. :-)
OH! I remember: aluminium, like chrominium. Got it!

Jerry
--
Engineering is the art of making what you want from things you can get.
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯ ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected] ups.com...
>
> Shytot wrote:
> > "Tuurbo46" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:dd0c5q$5t7$[email protected]..
> > > Hi
> > >
> > > Im about to start my final year at university and undertake my
specilised
> > > DSP module. Can anybody advice me on some warm up maths to prepare
me? I
> > > would preper if somebody could recommend a book with plenty of
> > undergraduate
> > > worked examples.
> > >
> > > Cheers Turbo
> > >
> > >
> > Well the first thing is to spell it right...Maths (plural) as in proper
> > English.
> >
> > Shytot
>
> Richard Feynman calls it math. Looks like the noble prize winner is
> wrong. Maybe you are super women. I will try to look out for your
> name on the next Physics paper.
>
Feyman was a Yank,what do you expect, they can't spell.

Shytot

Shytot wrote:

...

> Feyman was a Yank,what do you expect, they can't spell.

Totally without honor.

Jerry
--
Engineering is the art of making what you want from things you can get.
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯ ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

Jerry Avins wrote:
>
> Totally without honor.
>

No, just without (yo)u.

;-)

Ciao,

Peter K.

"Jerry Avins" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]..
> Shytot wrote:
>
> ...
>
> > Feyman was a Yank,what do you expect, they can't spell.
>
> Totally without honor.
>
>

Honour!

Shytot

On Fri, 5 Aug 2005 19:46:14 +0100, "Tuurbo46" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>Hi
>
>Im about to start my final year at university and undertake my specilised
>DSP module. Can anybody advice me on some warm up maths to prepare me? I
>would preper if somebody could recommend a book with plenty of undergraduate
>worked examples.
>
>Cheers Turbo

Hi,
Ya' might have a look at:

http://www.redcedar.com/learndsp.htm

Good Luck,
[-Rick-]

On Sun, 7 Aug 2005 06:57:16 +1200, "Shytot" <[email protected]> wrote:

(snipped)
>>
>> Richard Feynman calls it math. Looks like the noble prize winner is
>> wrong. Maybe you are super women. I will try to look out for your
>> name on the next Physics paper.
>>
>Feyman was a Yank,what do you expect, they can't spell.
>
>Shytot

Ha ha. Cute.

Check (cheque) this:

http://www.amren.com/mtnews/archives..._library_m.php

See Ya',
[-Rick-]

Rick Lyons wrote:
> On Fri, 5 Aug 2005 19:46:14 +0100, "Tuurbo46" <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>
>>Hi
>>
>>Im about to start my final year at university and undertake my specilised
>>DSP module. Can anybody advice me on some warm up maths to prepare me? I
>>would preper if somebody could recommend a book with plenty of undergraduate
>>worked examples.
>>
>>Cheers Turbo
>
>
> Hi,
> Ya' might have a look at:
>
> http://www.redcedar.com/learndsp.htm
>
> Good Luck,
> [-Rick-]
>
>
Thanks for the reference Rick. Now, if anyone catches me out with a
spelling mistake, I can simply quote that unlucky artist:
“The people that are into humanities, and are into Blake’s concept of
enlightenment, they are not looking at the words,” she said. “In their
mind the words register correctly.”

To get back to the issue of math vs. maths:
As an adjective,'mathematic' is commonly used as an alternative to
'mathematical,' as in 'mathematic procedure,' but I don't think I have
ever seen 'mathematic' used as a noun.

I believe that in the USA you can have a "Professors of Mathematics,"
but not a "Professor of Mathematic," and yet this would be abbreviated
to "Professor of Math."

Not to say that 'math' is always wrong: if you were to say, for example,
"I need a math book because I am studying math," in my opinion the first
use of 'math' would be acceptable because it is the abbreviation of the
adjective 'mathematic' but not the second use, because it is the
abbreviation of the noun 'mathematics.'

I have been trying to think of another example where the abbreviation of
a plural noun becomes singular, but have not come up with anything.


Language is a funny thing and is full of exceptions, so I am not saying
this particular usage is wrong, but to Australian ears it is certainly
quaint.



Regards,
John

John Monro wrote:
> Rick Lyons wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 5 Aug 2005 19:46:14 +0100, "Tuurbo46" <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Hi
>>>
>>> Im about to start my final year at university and undertake my
>>> specilised DSP module. Can anybody advice me on some warm up maths
>>> to prepare me? I would preper if somebody could recommend a book
>>> with plenty of undergraduate worked examples.
>>>
>>> Cheers Turbo
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>> Ya' might have a look at:
>>
>> http://www.redcedar.com/learndsp.htm
>>
>> Good Luck,
>> [-Rick-]
>>
>>
> Thanks for the reference Rick. Now, if anyone catches me out with a
> spelling mistake, I can simply quote that unlucky artist:
> “The people that are into humanities, and are into Blake’s concept of
> enlightenment, they are not looking at the words,” she said. “In their
> mind the words register correctly.”
>
> To get back to the issue of math vs. maths:
> As an adjective,'mathematic' is commonly used as an alternative to
> 'mathematical,' as in 'mathematic procedure,' but I don't think I have
> ever seen 'mathematic' used as a noun.
>
> I believe that in the USA you can have a "Professors of Mathematics,"
> but not a "Professor of Mathematic," and yet this would be abbreviated
> to "Professor of Math."
>
> Not to say that 'math' is always wrong: if you were to say, for example,
> "I need a math book because I am studying math," in my opinion the first
> use of 'math' would be acceptable because it is the abbreviation of the
> adjective 'mathematic' but not the second use, because it is the
> abbreviation of the noun 'mathematics.'
>
> I have been trying to think of another example where the abbreviation of
> a plural noun becomes singular, but have not come up with anything.
>
>
> Language is a funny thing and is full of exceptions, so I am not saying
> this particular usage is wrong, but to Australian ears it is certainly
> quaint.

If "mathematic" were a singular noun and "mathematics" its plural, then
the abbreviation of singular would be "math" and of the plural, "maths".
That's not the case. "Mathematics" is singular, so 's' is not an
appropriate ending in American usage. British subjects use the plural in
another way we Americans find strange. You construe "government",
"corporation", "department" and other entities consisting of groups of
people as plural, yet you say "a government" and "a corporation". To us,
the indefinite article emphasizes that the grammatical number is
singular. It seems as ungrammatical to us to say "a government are" as
it is so say "a bicycle are" despite its plurality of wheels.

In Australia, is "economics" abbreviated "econs" or "econ"?

Jerry
--
Engineering is the art of making what you want from things you can get.
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯ ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

On Fri, 12 Aug 2005 11:59:50 +1000, John Monro
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Rick Lyons wrote:
>> On Fri, 5 Aug 2005 19:46:14 +0100, "Tuurbo46" <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Hi
>>>
>>>Im about to start my final year at university and undertake my specilised
>>>DSP module. Can anybody advice me on some warm up maths to prepare me? I
>>>would preper if somebody could recommend a book with plenty of undergraduate
>>>worked examples.

Just for an OOTC, brush up on trig and complex numbers, among other
things I can't think of offhand.

BTW, Is trig a universal English abbreviation for trigonometry?

>>>Cheers Turbo
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>> Ya' might have a look at:
>>
>> http://www.redcedar.com/learndsp.htm
>>
>> Good Luck,
>> [-Rick-]
>>
>>
>Thanks for the reference Rick. Now, if anyone catches me out with a
>spelling mistake, I can simply quote that unlucky artist:
>“The people that are into humanities, and are into Blake’s concept of
>enlightenment, they are not looking at the words,” she said. “In their
>mind the words register correctly.”
>
>To get back to the issue of math vs. maths:
>As an adjective,'mathematic' is commonly used as an alternative to
>'mathematical,' as in 'mathematic procedure,' but I don't think I have
>ever seen 'mathematic' used as a noun.
>
>I believe that in the USA you can have a "Professors of Mathematics,"
>but not a "Professor of Mathematic," and yet this would be abbreviated
>to "Professor of Math."
>
>Not to say that 'math' is always wrong: if you were to say, for example,
>"I need a math book because I am studying math," in my opinion the first
>use of 'math' would be acceptable because it is the abbreviation of the
>adjective 'mathematic' but not the second use, because it is the
>abbreviation of the noun 'mathematics.'

But here in the USA the second use would be "just as correct" as
the first use. The word maths looks funny to me, though I've gotten
used to seeing it in Usenet threads such as this one. It's all math to
me. Seeing maths (or aluminium or "take the lift instead of the
stairs" or +ve or any of several other things) tips me off that I'm
reading a non-US writer.

>I have been trying to think of another example where the abbreviation of
>a plural noun becomes singular, but have not come up with anything.

It's not that it's singular, is that math can be, and usually us,
as plural as is mathematics. The plural of quail can be quail, same
spelling (it can also be quails, but that's not the point here).
There are surely lexicographers who can dig up the history of such
words, and determine where both math and maths originated as
abbreviations of mathematics.

>Language is a funny thing and is full of exceptions, so I am not saying
>this particular usage is wrong, but to Australian ears it is certainly
>quaint.

The advent of the Internet and international communication between
'ordinary people' certainly brings up these differences (reporters
outside their native land know to 'translate' dialects of English so
it sounds right to their homeland readers/listeners/viewers, so seeing
the difference in media is rare unless you read or hear something
published or broadcast elsewhere). Years ago when I first saw +ve and
-ve used by a British poster, I thought these were his personal
abbreviations for positive and negative, but I've since discovered
they are commonly used outside the USA. I don't think I had ever seen
these before in any writings.

With English being The Standard Language of The Internet, it's not
just the US(A) and Great Britain anymore, the Whole World is now
Separated By A Common Language.

>
>
>
>Regards,
>John

-----
http://www.mindspring.com/~benbradley

Ben, in response to my comment:
>
>>I have been trying to think of another example where the abbreviation of
>>a plural noun becomes singular, but have not come up with anything.
>
>
you wrote:
> It's not that it's singular, is that math can be, and usually us,
> as plural as is mathematics. The plural of quail can be quail, same
> spelling (it can also be quails, but that's not the point here).
> There are surely lexicographers who can dig up the history of such
> words, and determine where both math and maths originated as
> abbreviations of mathematics.
>
>
Ben, my point was all English speakers use the term 'mathematics' as a
noun, but never 'mathematic' as a noun.

I accept what you say about 'math' being as plural as 'mathematics,'
because I accept that this is the convention that has developed. I
still find it strange though that you drop the 's' when abbreviating the
word, and we keep it. No reason why you shouldn't of course:
abbreviations are all about dropping letters, but as I mentioned, I
can't think of any other word in which the plural loses the 's' ending
when abbreviated.

Regards,
John

John Monro wrote:
> Ben, in response to my comment:
>
>>
>>> I have been trying to think of another example where the abbreviation
>>> of a plural noun becomes singular, but have not come up with anything.
>>
>>
>>
> you wrote:
>
>> It's not that it's singular, is that math can be, and usually us,
>> as plural as is mathematics. The plural of quail can be quail, same
>> spelling (it can also be quails, but that's not the point here).
>> There are surely lexicographers who can dig up the history of such
>> words, and determine where both math and maths originated as
>> abbreviations of mathematics.
>>
>>
> Ben, my point was all English speakers use the term 'mathematics' as a
> noun, but never 'mathematic' as a noun.
>
> I accept what you say about 'math' being as plural as 'mathematics,'
> because I accept that this is the convention that has developed. I
> still find it strange though that you drop the 's' when abbreviating the
> word, and we keep it. No reason why you shouldn't of course:
> abbreviations are all about dropping letters, but as I mentioned, I
> can't think of any other word in which the plural loses the 's' ending
> when abbreviated.

I guess that my earlier message hadn't reached you when you wrote that.

1) "Mathematics" is singular, so no s is needed in the abbreviation.
2) Is "economics" or "obstetrics" abbreviated with an 's' in Australia?

Jerry
--
Engineering is the art of making what you want from things you can get.
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯ ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

Jerry Avins wrote:
> John Monro wrote:
>
>> Rick Lyons wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri, 5 Aug 2005 19:46:14 +0100, "Tuurbo46" <[email protected]>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Hi
>>>>
>>>> Im about to start my final year at university and undertake my
>>>> specilised DSP module. Can anybody advice me on some warm up maths
>>>> to prepare me? I would preper if somebody could recommend a book
>>>> with plenty of undergraduate worked examples.
>>>>
>>>> Cheers Turbo
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi,
>>> Ya' might have a look at:
>>>
>>> http://www.redcedar.com/learndsp.htm
>>>
>>> Good Luck,
>>> [-Rick-]
>>>
>>>
>> Thanks for the reference Rick. Now, if anyone catches me out with a
>> spelling mistake, I can simply quote that unlucky artist:
>> “The people that are into humanities, and are into Blake’s concept of
>> enlightenment, they are not looking at the words,” she said. “In their
>> mind the words register correctly.”
>>
>> To get back to the issue of math vs. maths:
>> As an adjective,'mathematic' is commonly used as an alternative to
>> 'mathematical,' as in 'mathematic procedure,' but I don't think I have
>> ever seen 'mathematic' used as a noun.
>>
>> I believe that in the USA you can have a "Professors of Mathematics,"
>> but not a "Professor of Mathematic," and yet this would be abbreviated
>> to "Professor of Math."
>>
>> Not to say that 'math' is always wrong: if you were to say, for
>> example, "I need a math book because I am studying math," in my
>> opinion the first use of 'math' would be acceptable because it is the
>> abbreviation of the adjective 'mathematic' but not the second use,
>> because it is the abbreviation of the noun 'mathematics.'
>>
>> I have been trying to think of another example where the abbreviation
>> of a plural noun becomes singular, but have not come up with anything.
>>
>>
>> Language is a funny thing and is full of exceptions, so I am not
>> saying this particular usage is wrong, but to Australian ears it is
>> certainly quaint.
>
>
> If "mathematic" were a singular noun and "mathematics" its plural, then
> the abbreviation of singular would be "math" and of the plural, "maths".
> That's not the case. "Mathematics" is singular, so 's' is not an
> appropriate ending in American usage.

Jerry,
I don't agree that "mathematics" is singular as I have always
understood the apparent plural ending to show that it is the study of a
lot of different mathematical (or mathematic) fields. Leaving that
aside though, if it is appropriate for a singular noun to have a 's'
ending (and I am not disputing that some singular nouns do) then why do
you say is it not appropriate to keep the 's' when abbreviating?


British subjects use the plural in
> another way we Americans find strange. You construe "government",
> "corporation", "department" and other entities consisting of groups of
> people as plural, yet you say "a government" and "a corporation".
To us,
> the indefinite article emphasizes that the grammatical number is
> singular. It seems as ungrammatical to us to say "a government are" as
> it is so say "a bicycle are" despite its plurality of wheels.
>


That is more a matter of education than nationality Jerry. Sure, I have
heard people say "The Government are a pack of no-hopers," but you would
not see this printed in a newspaper for example. (Particularly a Murdock
newspaper :=) The correct usage in Australia is "The Government is a
pack of no-hopers."

On your side of the Pacific, what about the use of the term
'multi-media' (it should be "multi-media") or the use of 'data' as in
"...the processor reads one byte of data" (it should be 'datum,' but who
cares?).


> In Australia, is "economics" abbreviated "econs" or "econ"?


> No, usually 'BS' :=). Actually, probably 'eco' in a University
time-table or such, so I take your point, but it would not be a
recognised abbreviation for verbal use. On reflection, I can't recall
seeing 'economics' abbreviated at all. I have seen 'physics'
abbreviated as 'phys' but that also would not be universally recognised.
By the way, would you use 'phy' for 'physics?' :=)


Regards,
John

sorry for my lack of interest in the previous language
discussion.

Tuurbo46: this is the place to start and an ultimate DSP
intro: http://www.dspguide.com/

free for download in pdf, code included also

hope it helps,

cheers,
K.

Jerry Avins <[email protected]> writes:

> I guess that my earlier message hadn't reached you when you wrote that.
>
> 1) "Mathematics" is singular, so no s is needed in the abbreviation.

I don't agree that it is.

See, e.g. www.dictionary.com:

mathematics

n : a science (or group of related sciences) dealing with the logic of
quantity and shape and arrangement [syn: math, maths]

> 2) Is "economics" or "obstetrics" abbreviated with an 's' in Australia?

I agree with John that economics would go to "eco". Obstetrics, I've
only ever heard as "Ob/gyn".

Ciao,

Peter K.

Jerry Avins <[email protected]> writes:

> 1) "Mathematics" is singular, so no s is needed in the abbreviation.
> 2) Is "economics" or "obstetrics" abbreviated with an 's' in Australia?

What would you say for an abbreviation of "electronics" ?

I think I'd say "electro".

Ciao,

Peter K.

PS: A friend of mine, when writing papers, says "Never abbr.!".

Peter K. wrote:
> What would you say for an abbreviation of "electronics" ?
>
> I think I'd say "electro".

I abbreviated it as "'tronics" - although only colloquially.

--
Jim Thomas Principal Applications Engineer Bittware, Inc
[email protected] http://www.bittware.com (603) 226-0404 x536
Getting an inch of snow is like winning ten cents in the lottery - Calvin

John Monro wrote:

...

> Jerry,
> I don't agree that "mathematics" is singular as I have always
> understood the apparent plural ending to show that it is the study of a
> lot of different mathematical (or mathematic) fields. Leaving that
> aside though, if it is appropriate for a singular noun to have a 's'
> ending (and I am not disputing that some singular nouns do) then why do
> you say is it not appropriate to keep the 's' when abbreviating?

Most abbreviations consist of the beginning letters of the longer word,
although some omit intervening vowels. An almost universal exception has
to do with plurals, as I've been carrying on about. They "reach over"
the omitted letters to attach the final s (or other ending in other
languages). While it's not inappropriate to attach a final s to a
singular word, it's not the more common way. "Maths" seems as strange to
me as "ecos" probably does to you. That is by way of explanation, not
argument about what's correct. There's no arguing about idiomatic use.
When one considers "fo'c's'le", there's no arguing with abbreviations.

But consider: The names of many disciplines end in s: phonics, physics,
hermeneutics, as well as the ones I've mentioned. I see no compelling
indication that they are to be considered plural. If one abbreviates a
singular "mathematics" with its final s, shouldn't it be "math's"?

> British subjects use the plural in
>
>> another way we Americans find strange. You construe "government",
>> "corporation", "department" and other entities consisting of groups of
>> people as plural, yet you say "a government" and "a corporation".
>
>> To us,
>> the indefinite article emphasizes that the grammatical number is
>> singular. It seems as ungrammatical to us to say "a government are" as
>> it is so say "a bicycle are" despite its plurality of wheels.
>
> That is more a matter of education than nationality Jerry. Sure, I have
> heard people say "The Government are a pack of no-hopers," but you would
> not see this printed in a newspaper for example. (Particularly a Murdock
> newspaper :=) The correct usage in Australia is "The Government is a
> pack of no-hopers."

Interesting. I have heard Queen Elizabeth (in a broadcast) say "My
government are ..." and seen the speech printed that way. It seems to be
a British standard.

> On your side of the Pacific, what about the use of the term
> 'multi-media' (it should be "multi-media") or the use of 'data' as in
> "...the processor reads one byte of data" (it should be 'datum,' but who
> cares?).

Eh? What is the difference between 'multi-media' and "multi-media"? The
incorrect use of "media" and "data" as singular has become so common
that it is likely to become accepted soon. Although I avoid using them
as singular, I often find a way (when writing) to use them properly in
the plural. I do write "the data are", but I rarely write about a datum.
Except in surveying or statistics, I wouldn't be understood. It's become
so bad that I heard one television news reporter speak of "a media of
exchange".

....

> By the way, would you use 'phy' for 'physics?' :=)

No. I would use the first four letters, just as in "math". :^)

Jerry
--
Engineering is the art of making what you want from things you can get.
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯ ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

Peter K. wrote:
> Jerry Avins <[email protected]> writes:
>
>
>>I guess that my earlier message hadn't reached you when you wrote that.
>>
>>1) "Mathematics" is singular, so no s is needed in the abbreviation.
>
>
> I don't agree that it is.
>
> See, e.g. www.dictionary.com:
>
> mathematics
>
> n : a science (or group of related sciences) dealing with the logic of
> quantity and shape and arrangement [syn: math, maths]

I don't question the existence of "maths" or even its legitimacy. In
language, anything goes (after a while and with widespread use). I claim
only that its existence is odd, and leads people to wrongly conclude
that "mathematics" is plural. No one has shown me a mathematic.

The name for a thing that encompasses many other things does not by that
compass become plural; if it were so, then "dictionary" would be plural.

>>2) Is "economics" or "obstetrics" abbreviated with an 's' in Australia?
>
>
> I agree with John that economics would go to "eco". Obstetrics, I've
> only ever heard as "Ob/gyn".

That's short for "obstetrics/gynecology", but there you have it. How
does "obs/gyn" sit with you?

Jerry
--
Engineering is the art of making what you want from things you can get.
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯ ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯